Some insights into men and women

I will preface this by saying I'm a very good looking man... tall, blonde hair, strong jaw, bodybuilder physique, great symmetry to boot... I've had women on many occasions ask if I was a model, or that I look like "Ken" from Barbie and Ken... Although I like to take care of my body and workout, it has more to do with a natural need to get stronger and better myself physically, than some superficial need... or to feel superior or flaunt myself to those that aren't as good looking... hell, I always wear a sweatshirt when I workout because I don't want to "see" myself externally, preferring to visualize the process internally as I workout.....


Anyways, this is all to say that it doesn't matter... I found it doesn't matter that I'm good looking, have a good body and mind when it comes to women...

I found both really beautiful women and the not to so beautiful tend to act almost exactly the same way once they get into a relationship with me... I once thought that choosing a girl that wasn't so good looking would be more committed and loyal to developing something "cerebral" with me,... rather than say, existing in that superficial space where both parties just coast by in a relationship indulging in each others looks, just wanting to be "seen" as a pretty couple everywhere they go ( as a way to flaunt power of course ), partaking in every generic activity as if you're some perfect airbrushed magazine ideal couple... In fact, at bottom, that's what I think a lot of beautiful girls long for... the "appearance" of a beautiful life... the handsome man, the money, the generic activities that couples always engage in... a never repeating pattern of doing the same things while over-indulging in appearance......

Well, things aren't any different with the uglier girl... and that's where the real tragedy is.... Even the uglier chicks want what the beautiful girls want... they want the beautiful magazine/movie life too... and what's worse is, because they can't have it, they end up building up a lot of resentment towards not only better looking women, but any man that isn't capable of "elevating" her to that ideal Photoshopped place in the sky....

Now, my problem was getting with the uglier girl hoping that she would be past superficial things and she wasn't... Even though I would be relatively better looking than her, she just wanted to live that beautiful life, wanted to be "seen", wanted to dress up all the time, etc etc... Having deep discussions on philosophy were not to be had.... and BY FAR the TOUCHIEST subject is analyzing the actual male-female dynamic...which is, IMO, the most powerful thing in the world, that connection, that antagonism... YET, women seem to hate talking about it.... They think they have some dominion in "love" and "romance" yet hate to actually intellectualize what these terms mean...She'll say, defensively, of course, "you're thinking too much, you're not 'feeling' " when pressed about anything that goes below the surface... Or that I'm being "aggressive" or "pressing" too much(intellectually) instead of just going with it ( i.e. just going with the natural attraction between us... i.e. just "passive coasting".... it seems very hard to develop a deeper connection that is forged through substantial dialoging, dialoging that EXPOSES each others weakness and strengths, where both parties come out more honest, more HUMBLE, with greater clarity and above all, a greater connection......The goal should be to develop a connection that goes beyond emotional vicissitudes while at the same time taking advantage of that well of chaotic energy that lies at the bottom of the male-female dynamic.... and the only way to get to this higher place is to expose and test each other, while staying committed to a higher ideal....

I think a part of the problem is that women feel weaker in deeper discussions, or more accurately, they feel a lack of control... when men are at the whims of a women's emotional needs he becomes in a very real way, a slave... and the relationship itself becomes something very ugly... there is nothing noble about it.... and the sad thing is, when a women gains this sort of control, at bottom, she's not really happy either.... she starts to victimize herself... she'll say to herself incessantly that "he isn't meeting my needs" and she'll start to revenge herself on him with more pity and guilty trips, while playing coy and hard to get still on some level... just to give the guy a "bone" to chase while she exerts control through emotional manipulation.....

This type of relationship seems almost the law now, with men ( even the best looking and wealthy) chasing after women... all clarity is lost, they both live in an emotional haze... even literally paying "tribute" to some Christian god in some half-assed way to feel "spiritual" while the most precious energy on earth (the male-female dynamic) for REAL spiritual clarity and transcendence is WASTED with emotional manipulation and selfishness.....

Men and women convince themselves they are "in love" yet they never actually develop the love.. just being together with another person without any cerebral development equates to not much more than co-dependency, where men become not only saps to the emotional cycles of women but much much worse... they become dependent and start to need this sort of relationship to feel "at peace".... I.E. the natural aggression of man that should be channeled into something very spiritual and strong(in union with a willing female) turns inward and the man's own aggression tears him up as he tries ( in vain of course) to please a women who is in perpetual need of "emotional support".... and he calls this running to her needs like a dog, "devotion."

I



and it goes without saying that men are the romantic ones not women... women love to be "romanced" in a passive way while men actively does the romancing... so when a women says she is "romantic" that's code for "i love when men bend over backwards for me".... And what is the favor she returns for all his hard work besides sex? A flimsy sense of devotion and loyalty based on some presupposed notion that men must always cater to a women's unfulfilled needs... needs that are in themselves unfulfilled because she REFUSES to look deeply into her self and her motivations.... and WHY does she refuse to do so... maybe because she would venture further from that superficial ideal magazine place where all the "beautiful" people seem to roam around in perpetual bliss.... She refuses to believe this isn't real beauty or refuses to give up the hope for this type of bliss.

And you wanna know the WORST tragedy for modern man.... You can analyze the hell out of the dynamic between men and women, you can source all her motivations, feel frustrated and angry at her superficiality, you can vent all day long... but it will NOT change her... she'll still possess you with that uncontrollable energy.... and at bottom, even though she might not fully understand this intellectually, she knows through intuition how energizing she makes men...she can easily tell when a man is starting to fall in love and so her coy emotional manipulative game begins without anything deeper even getting a chance!

I have had the most beautiful dreams imaginable about a women, just getting closer to her in my dream, feeling the truth of that connection between man and women expressing itself in outpouring radiant energy... There is NOTHING, not war between men, nothing, ...that can compare to the sense of URGENCY when a connection, when that instant attraction shows itself between a man in women... love at first site...

The Tragedy is that that most powerful, precious energy almost immediately starts to go to WASTE, is never substantiated into something transcendent.... so many factors now seemingly rage war between men and women that the only thing you can do is dream....

If I didn't feel this deep need to have children and a real beautiful loving family, I would become completely abstinent and just "internalize" women and search for truth in solitude.... In fact, that might be the most rewarding path for many men today, because most women are destroyed by the culture we live in... and everyone is to blame for this....

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I think a part of the problem is that women feel weaker in deeper discussions, or more accurately, they feel a lack of control

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They are this way because they have not been raised to value their own intellect, they are handicapped in their ability to value their own unique/creative thoughts. Hence their feeling weak is a genuine inbound feeling and their lack of control reflects their actual lack of confidence in being able to affect their own lives/environment/others/ the world with their unique thoughts.

What I am trying to express is that given the fact that from birth women's normal human growth, which includes the ability to create and respect ones own unique thoughts, is stunted so heavily by their parents and our social world, that most women are not capable of engaging in a true, non-rehersed, creative and genuine conversation. Everything they say and do for them (within their own psyche) needs to be validated somehow by the external world - and what is it that the external world provides the most (though false) validation for? Their looks - how glamorous they are, how beautiful they are, how feminine they are defined by superficial standards and false ideals of femininity. And of course how sexually appealing they are - which is defined by their looks. So the expectation that women are somehow capable of even entering an actual healthy relationship with a man that goes beyond friendship, seems quite unrealistic. Women need to begin with unearthing base simple, yet deep rooted things - like acknowledging to themselves that when they look in the mirror and apply their make up, or straighten their hair, or put on that pair of high heels - that these things are not right in the world. Even if she is not able to repel doing these things herself, like if she doesn't feel secure enough to go without these things, simply acknowledging that that feeling of insecurity is a reflection of how abhorrently twisted the world is, should be a starting point, imo, towards freeing her own mind. It should bring tears to her eyes that she does these things and is made to feel that it is necessary in order to survive in this world. According to me if a woman goes through something that sounds so simple, yet is so deep rooted, she will begin her own battle with these injustices. And as a result become a person more able to explore relationships and have the capacity to have actual conversations with a companion.

There is alot of pain within a woman. Alot of pain, alot of hostility, alot of anger. Women need to connect with this pain and according to me connecting with this pain is what paves the path of self respect. Because when you feel that pain, and you begin to understand it's cause, the anger that is released can only be vindicated when you start following yourself and seeking/experiencing freedom. And freedom does not come from controlling another human being or from controlling a man - it comes from listening to your heart and having the strength and self fortitude to follow it even if you feel you're the only one walking on that path.

I think you simply need to find a woman who is more on par with where you're at in terms of depth and intellect. I absolutely do not feel weak in deeper discussions .. if anything, I feel weak in superficial discussions. I enjoy analysing the male-female dynamic, and I crave a relationship that is more focused on dissolving ego rather than building it up. But sadly, we are all mostly egos here, trying to connect, with all the hidden complexity and struggle that implies.

I find it's best to focus on what I know, which is more about me than about others. I can't speak for them. And complaining that they are not the way I would like is simply disguised frustration and anger over the fact that I am not getting what I want. I suspect your desire to have a family is what leads to your frustration with how you presently see the state of the world, including women.

In my mind, it is simply my own unconscious defenses that keep me from connecting with another soul who can give me what I truly want. Without such defenses, I doubt I'd pay heed to the craziness that abounds out there. I think men and women are both destroyed by the culture we live in, to varying degrees. My suggestion to you would be to focus on your own growth, on uncovering your own unconscious defenses which keep you from finding what you truly want .. which may or may not be a family.

There are others out there who are on same journey you are .. even some women.

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A woman almost needs to segregate herself from the desire of a men in order to discover her own sense of self because whenever a man is involved in that process, even if he is trying to help her, her propensity to lean on him to solve her personal sense of worthlessness and compensate for it through his devotion or desire will probably slow her attempts. Though, at the same time, having a man accessible so that she can constantly identify and challenge that virus within her is also a useful tool.

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Well said, Decius.

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My suggestion to you would be to focus on your own growth, on uncovering your own unconscious defenses which keep you from finding what you truly want .. which may or may not be a family.

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Well, what keeps me from getting I want isn't my "unconscious defenses" but the lack of a receptive women for the reasons outlined above. You're response is pretty lethargic(maybe you're just tired?)... It's the "everything will be better, just keep on truckin'" or "the 'right' one is out there".... Those very attitudes seem to be apart the problem as well... Even when two people are very attracted to each other on a physical level (thus the "right" one), the obstacles noted above start to come into play... And when they split it's always because he or she was not the "right" one... thus always a superficial optimistic view of the future that will influence the next relationship... until people become literally too old or jaded or mentally and physically exhausted that they settle for someone who isn't ideal... A relationship just becomes something where both parties can fulfill basic sexual urges on a regular basis, have someone to dialogue with so they don't feel alone and pathetic, and have someone to participate in the mundane activities of societies so they can feel apart of the world.... Women realize they won't find prince charming and men are gradually so beaten down by the world that they become submissive and lose their natural aggressiveness that makes them attractive to begin with.... It's actually very gross to look at most couples and how sedated and uninspired they are, content to just exist as yet another couple... like cows in a field or something... the worst thing is that pale quiet image influences single men and women and they fall right into the same generic relationship.......

You get the girl, you're witty strong, just distant enough, etc etc... try to break away from the mold of everyday existence and her true desires come to the forefront....

I'm quite certain that Shakespeare's "Romeo and Juliet" is completely lost on women... Or people will say that's just "young 'immature' love"... To be so attached/connected/entwined in another person's Self to immediately kill yourself once you find out they're dead,... that's devotion, that's transcendence.

I noticed younger girls(early 20's) are more passionate(not sexually necessarily as older women are very sexual too, but in their readiness to fall deeply in love)... it's like as they get older, they "expect" that a certain material existence is a necessity... They want "love" as a side dish to a cookie-cutter domestic life...

It really is almost a race to find the right one, and you have to be aggressive and active... Because a big age gap is no good, the levels of intellectual maturity will be too great... The sad thing is how everyone just wastes their youth and all that precious vital energy just drinking and wasting away in stagnant relationships etc without thought to how they are destroying their potential and building terrible patterns that will hinder future relationships...

Women wait for the richest guy... men search for the hottest girl that's the least hassle, a fuck-toy while he watches fucking football like a tool, and calls that being a man...

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You're response is pretty lethargic(maybe you're just tired?)... It's the "everything will be better, just keep on truckin'" or "the 'right' one is out there"....

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Ummm, no, I don't think that is accurate at all. Read it again perhaps?

Or not. Maybe my response to your post simply wasn't to your liking.

Good luck in your search.

I just want to add that anyone really interested in the male-female dynamic should read Nietzsche... that guy really understands women and the power of feminine energy.

i see a lot of this attitude toward women on this forum, and i find it very curious indeed. sure there are women who are assholes and selfish etc. but there are also countles women who are not.
i happened to notice that many of the males here are young - in their 20s - and i'm figuring this could be the main reason.

I agree, sun ... they are perhaps too young to have really faced enough demons in themselves, choosing the easier path which sees the demons outside, battling them there where it's seemingly safer. But sadly, it's like watching them with a big magic marker, slashing angry x's across faces on the movie screen, frustrated that the picture doesn't really change. They know not that they'd have better luck looking back to where the projector lies.

i wonder how these guys fail to notice the countless men who have partners and are quite content with them. this also includes young couples.
obviously there are some women out there worth having a relationship with so why the sweeping generalizations?