are emotions what define human beings? - Page 2

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Example, take away everything you have, (car, body, brain, energy, awareness...)
then what have you become? Nothing, true?
So maybe the question isn't who am I? What am I?
But rather, what do 'I' have?

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Hmm . . that may be true for you but I would still be me
& you would still be you.

"Hmm . . that may be true for you but I would still be me
& you would still be you."

You would still be you? What are you? Eplain what 'you' are, and I am sure that 'you' can be broken down into a series of things to be had.

Remember the picture of two faces and the vase in the middle of the faces? The vase would not exist without having the the two faces, and the two faces would not exist without the vase. Consider you or me to be the vase, and the two faces to be things you have, like brain, energy, awarness.....ect.... now if you change the things you have, (change the shape of the faces), than you, (the vase), changes too. If you take away all that you have (the two faces) then you (the vase) is also nonexistant. Get it?

You may not think my analogy is not comparable to the subject, but if you know the picture I am talking about, please at least understand the concept I am trying to get accross. If you do not agree, then please explain with a little more detail.

Why would you even post in a thread like this if you thought the explanation was as simple as 'I would still be me & you would still be you.' More explanation please. Maybe some logical reasoning?.?.?.

I didn't understand your analogy, maybe I missed the point but it didn't seem to make any sense. The vase can exist without two faces, if you mean because it is covered and a picture then you are speculating, I won't explain more untill I understand what you meant to begin with.

have you every seen the picture?

Since I don't think I know what you are talking about I'll guess no.

http://www.coolopticalillusions.com/optical_illusions_pictures_3/faces_a
nd_goblet_illusion.htm

Yeah, It is pretty hard to get ideas accross if we can't communicate and understand eachother....

take a look at the wine goblet picture in the link, notice that the space around the wine goblet looks like two faces in profile looking at each other, it is alright if you don't see it at first.... If you can see the faces, and the wine goblet (Icalled it a vase), than you can understand that if the wine goblet is erased, then so must the faces and vise/versa.

that should start things off..

I didn't see the pitcure, but I know what ur talking about. It's being talked in detail in the thread 'what is the soul'

Basically, he's asking the question, 'who am I', upon which the entire religion of Buddhisim is based.
Basically, we all make the mistake of mistaking our 'personality', for ourselves. What you did 5 years ago, your face, wheather ur a kind hearted person or a cruel one, these are all your 'personality', not your inner 'essence', which you may call ur inner being or ur soul.

Enlightnment is about getting rid of this 'illusion', that we are our mind. When we realize that we are not our mind, our personality, our character, then we getin touch with the true 'I'

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Enlightnment is about getting rid of this 'illusion', that we are our mind. When we realize that we are not our mind, our personality, our character, then we getin touch with the true 'I'

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I guess I missed that one (thread) so if I go hunting it is because I want (desire) too? I enjoy being part of the natural (wild) world.

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than you can understand that if the wine goblet is erased, then so must the faces and vise/versa.

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The physical existence is one the spiritual is intertwinded.
Looking at the linked site I liked the faces the longer I looked the more I saw?

"Looking at the linked site I liked the faces the longer I looked the more I saw?"

Sorry about that, it was the picture at the top of the page, here is a better link.
http://img66.exs.cx/img66/2153/goblet.gif

The profile faces are the white space around the black goblet on either side, there are only two that I am aware of. The faces are the white part, the goblet is the black, now I forgot what I was showing this to you for.

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Humans are conscious and have choice. A tadpole can't choose whether or not it wants to turn into a toad, it is just part of the natural evolution. If humans we more in touch with, and living our natural evolutionary process we, I believe, wouldn't be in the mess that we're in.

Where is worry in nature? If a flower spent any of its energy worrying about its future, its past or its present, like humans do; it would waste the energy that is needed to grow and do what is its natural evolution.

This is the transistion that comes from the evolutionary step of adapting to environments to adapting environments to us. Its part of the evolution that comes with foresight through abstract thought, it is a natural instinct to control and or defend yourself from any form of harm, well with the knowledge of an ability to affect and evironment to seemingly no end (just setbacks) and the ability to make the distinction of so many dangers, added to the free time to think about danger and fear it (thats a big one) worry at least has time and motivation, but yes, where does it come from, lets not make assumptions about nature not worrying such proof is currently unatainable.

Worry is sustained fear, usually in expectation of something in particular. It may be a developed instinct to compensate for getting lost in thought or thoughlessness, against complacency or inaction. The negative version perhaps.

I'm not sure what mess in particular you were referring to, if you by chance were referring to war at all, thats one of the most natural and common things in nature, death and destruction to form life and construction.

I figure the world will be balancing the currently tipping towards human scales of nature, we battle new diseases and stronger strains often enough for me to think it'll just take the right one to end or sufficiently depleat us. That or the sky falling (outside earth influece, as far as I know).

Or we make it to pure energy forms through life rather than death, either way it all seems to work out the same.

Mystic,

I understand your perspective but I believe we do choose everything, at least on some level, perhaps not consciously but we do choose it. I believe that we are co-creators in every and all aspects of our reality, life, family, chosen paths, and choices that we make. I described this belief in detail a couple of days ago on "What is the soul?" (top of pg 14 if you are interested)...

It sounds like you have done a lot of exploration and everyone comes to the conclusions they come to based on experiences they have and... every perspective is valid and part of the complete picture.

I admire your cander and modesty.

You don't have to respond to this part (or any part for that matter) but just a thought... by your last two posts in this thread... one about cancer and one about "running out of time" tells me that you believe you are just about finished this earthly exploration. If that's accurate then you are closer to knowing for certain what's actually going on than most if not all of us here. Not to make light of it but if you can find a way to let us know... I for one would be appreciative.

Wishing you well in your exploration and gaining the wisdom that you need, whatever that means, to find comfort in all that is.

That's funny. No apology necessary. Your intention wasn't to mislead me and it takes quite a bit to alarm me.

Glad to hear you're okay and still able to explore this overwhelming thing we call life!!!