The Qur'an

As I read it - I will share important verses to the cause of peace on a regular basis should anyone want to comment, feel free.

Surah 2:62 "Those who believe (in the Qur'an), and those who follow the Jewish (scriptures), and the Christians and the Sabians, and who believe in Allah and the Last Day, and work righteousness, shall have their reward with their Lord: on them shall be no fear, nor shall they grieve."

with scriptures, quotation marks usually means that the scribe has added this to aid in the translation

Surah 2:112/113 - "And they say: "none shall enter Paradise unless he be a Jew or Christian." Those are their (vain) desires. Say: "Produce your proof if you are truthful." Nay, - whoever submits his whole self to Allah and is a doer of good - he will get his reward with his Lord; on such shall be no fear, nor shall they grieve.

Surah 2:139 - "Say: Will you dispute with us about Allah, seeing that He is our Lord and your Lord; that we are responsible for our doings and you for yours; and that We are sincere (in our faith) in Him?"

Surah 2:285 "The Messenger believes in what has been revealed to him from his Lord, as do the men of faith. Each one (of them) believes in Allah, His angels, His books, and His Messengers. "We make no distinction (they say) between one and another of His Messengers." And they say: "We hear, and we obey: (we seek) Your forgiveness, Our Lord, and to You is the end of all journeys."

hi
are u muslim ?

no - just trying to undersand.

Surah 3:133-134: "Be quick in the race for forgiveness from your lord, and for a Garden whose width is that (of the whole) of the heavens and of the earth, prepared for the righteous, Those who spend (freely), whether in prosperity, or in adversity; who restrain anger, and pardon (all) men; - for Allah loves those who do good,-"

there are commas and dashes where there should be periods

I am curenly reading the section on women. It is not good, I will not quote any of that.

Surah 4:92: "Never should a Believer kill a Believer............."
Surah 4:93: "If a man kills a Believer intentionally, his recompense is Hell..................."
Surah 4:94: "O you who believe! when you go abroad in the cause of Allah, investigate carefully, and do not say to any one who offers you a salutation: "You are not a Believer!"......................."

To be fair, the bible doesn't treat women terribly well either.

Not true - the bible has a lot in it. Debora the prophet who ruled Isreal. The bible is hardly one sided on anything. It touches and describes almost all flavors of human kind. However, I will agree that the law of moses was one sided. If there is or was a false god, that false god wrote the law of moses. That's what a lot of Gnostics believed. They died for what they believed. It is written that Gnostic children were hung from stakes. What people will do in the name of their god?

Did you know, Dumbteen, that the second to Moses was his brother and sister. She also was given rule. Her name evades me.

Mosaic law was harsh, but to be even more fair, Jesus came to change those laws.
He was very loving about women in general, as he loved all, and did NOT come to die for only men.

As for the muslims, if I am correct, this is the religion formed after the breaking away from Abraham. When Agar was banished to the desert. With her offspring of Abraham, Ismael.
Genesis 16.

If this is true, the entire bible they contain comes from Agar's meeting with the angel of the Lord, she considered God.
Hmmm.
Anyway, I would have an interest in the parts they say about women.

Remember WOMEN have equal reward to heaven.
Remember too, women are to be loved as Jesus loves His bride the church.

Look to the New Testament. It improves the relationships with men and women. It also makes it clear that marriage is one man, one woman. The roles changed slightly, but not too obvious. It is the indirect approach.
Did you ever notice how we are to be loved?
Rather than in times of old, where women were used for trade?

If the Muslim bible says to not murder other believers....consider then they say Jews and Christians will be saved. And hence, that makes them believers too. So, in fact, besides they should not kill anyone anyway, but indirectly, they should NOT be killing christians and jews either.

There are plenty of examples in the bible of God being ok with men with many wives and of women being unworthy of being in front of some holy place/object or somesuch.
If you haven't read these passages I could dig them up.

I don't think any litteral interpretation of the bible is going to be much more tolerant then the Quran taken litteraly. Much of the things described (and approved) were normal at the time (slavery, archaic economics, veiled women), the trouble being the bible can't change with time. Our interpretation CAN change, and I think our interpretation of the bible should change as our culture does.

Yes, you can dig up those passages, in the old Mosiac laws. Again, that passed with the laws given by Christ.

Again, Jesus changed those laws.
Unless you are Jewish, and do not believe in the Christ whom was here in the flesh, then of course, it would make sense.

Are you following what I am saying?

Let me explain a tad more. Look at the laws today. Nations built on the basics of christian theology. Even the Quran you keep speaking of, sees that christianity is to be believed.

And nations upon nations believe in a marriage consisting of one woman, one man. The few who allow more, are minut in comparison. There will always be some exceptions to any rule.
That is a given. Am I not making sense?

You're kinda right about Islam. They claim it started when you say it did, but actually it was about 250 years after Christ. It does not have a good history. They waged war on the whole Arab world forcing all to follow it. But then so did Christianity. But the Christianity then is not the same as today so that means nothing to me and possibly Islam is in its infancy.

All that is in the bible under the name of Moses any true scholar knows that Moses did not write all that. Only a true scholar knows for sure and I'm not one. But it was common practice to use the name of a respected individual to make your writings valid. So the law of Moses is not really the law of moses. In the days of Jesus the scribes were very likely well decerned on this subject, they new what Jesus meant when he said, "I have come not to abolish the law but to complete it." I don't think we understand this. I'm not sure the scriptures we have are pure or complete. But someone said that the law is in our heart. I think we know what is right and wrong without it having to be written down, so nothing has really been lost except that our faith must now be stronger.

To understand the bibles stand on men and women, the answer is found in Genesis.

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1:27: So God created man in his own image, in the image of God created he him; male and female created he them.

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, "I have come not to abolish the law but to complete it."

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Well, just to show you, it is easiest to read Matthew, only because he favored using the 'quotes' from the old testament to show how Jesus 'fulfilled' the prophesied 'Christ'...Messiah.

He was referring to God the Father's laws. (The laws of Christ's nature, and how it would come to pass) He also mentioneed that Moses gave laws to man, regarding divorce, because he (Moses) knew man's hearts were hard.

quote:

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But someone said that the law is in our heart. I think we know what is right and wrong without it having to be written down, so nothing has really been lost except that our faith must now be stronger.

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I believe the heart is where the faith lives. Faith contains the laws. No one has to memorise the laws to know what LOVE is. LOVE is really the basics.
IF you Love God, and your neighbor, then all other things will fall in place.
You will not hurt others, and you will not hurt God.