AFTER DEATH - Page 2

I believe you are wrong. You are not a scientist. Thinking about something for hours proves nothing. Science hasn't proven any thing of the sort. Why is it that if we can't understand something it is not true. Is that science? Does science say, "I don't know how there can be a heaven or hell or reincarnation, so it can't be." Your science does. The science of the close minded. Actually though, you are wrong. Science has studied these things and came up with findings that neither proves or disproves anything, only creates more questions. Questions that have been moving science towards a belief in God. The mysteries or miracles will never be proven or disproven and your believe or disbelief will neither make these things true or false. But you wouldn't know that, you're just spouting out a bunch of stuff you know nothing about. You haven't studied it. This is a fact, compared to these mysteries, your mind is just a tiny little thing..

""The human heart refuses to believe in a universe without purpose."" Interesting notion about science, like science seems to indicate the earth is much older than biblical dating does? Doesn't that make you wonder 'how many times our we going to go around this circle before we get it right?

There was a major study done over more then a 10 year period in a major college by a well known professor. I tried to find the article, it was in Ventura Inward, but I lost it. The study continues. They have found lots of proof in reincarnation.

And my wife tells me that when a person dies, they immediately loss 4 pounds, science cannot account for this. They suspect that the soul weighs 4 pounds.

It is not four pounds. The most commonly accepted value is 21 ounces. Also, they "lose" it. Im not quite sure if you can "loss" something, even if it is immediate. The interesting thing is that something like a soul can be weighed. I doubt it. Most likely it is something with your respiration, or the person may have micturated on themselves before they were weighed. Plus, it was Aenigma's humble opinion he was stating, and not scientific research. Additionally, not believing in an afterlife does not make one close minded, and blind faith does not make one "open-minded". It actually proves how simple minded people can be.

Please take time to analyze your flames before you direct them at someone. I would rather not have to waste my time correcting you when I could be transcending the philosophical elsewhere.




-Siang

I believe you are wrong - is that a Flame? Your mind is small compared to the miracles of God - Is that the flame? Or was it, are you a scientist?

I have not flamed anyone, I have only disagreed. But this is not America and free speech is not allowed. Or is it wrong to question?

You have not corrected me, as I was not wrong.

I will ask you - Are you a scientist? What degree do you hold?

Show me proof that there is no after life and correct me if I'm wrong. Please waste your time.

Roger Harkness of Oklahoma City

Life after life? Is it possible? I have thought a great deal about this - no I am not a scientist and yes it does make all the difference inthe world. I think people are and always have been not just scarred but terrified of death and the prospect of non-exsistance. Heaven and hell are also used as tools of social control an ultimate judgment or accountability to the actions of people in their lives. But who is to say this is not heaven or hell itself or both at the same time? certainly we could imagine a life here that would be heavenly or hellish? I would like to beleive there is a nice afterlife a utopia where every day is perfect but I will not. I feel our sentience comes to a conclusion right after our physical lives do. Our bodies indeed break down and the energy within us is released and are reformed into other things.
That leaves us with the question what is the soul? Do we actually have one? are we more than our teachings and experiences our code of conduct & memories? But that is another issue.
Reincarnation and past lives are fabulous notions and to me that is all. BUT the ideas of afterlife and reincarnation should never be disproven as they are nessecary for the mental health of millions - I am sure that so many are comforted by these ideas and that is important ( seriously I am not trying to insult any-one here) In the light of this I must accept that an afterlife does exsist at least in the collective conciouness of our society.

I pretty much agree with you Melkor.
Though I believe there is such a thing as a "soul". What makes me, me (like my sig says) is the reason why I don't see the world through your eyes.

Melkor: The purpose of this post is to express your opinion - and you have done that very well - I respect that and you don't insult me. What you believe is not new. The new testament of the bible describes a group of people who believed like you. But someone else came in here before you claiming to speak for science. I object to that kind of talk, as the young man wasn't even a scientist, and he spoke for the whole scientific community - and my objection was even objected to, and I further object to that.

This is what was said: "Similar beliefs were created during a time when there was no better explanation to questions about the life, medicine, or the body. Science has come a long way since then, and does not support the theory of heaven/hell or reincarnation."

To that - I have this to say - Eat this:

http://www.childpastlives.org/stevenson.htm

The porpose of life is a question that has swam around my mind for some time- why am i here who am I what will become of me? Someone wrote that thinking and thinking about it is pointless- i beleive that is folly. Certainly there are guidelines and dogmas set up for us but As individuals we owe it to ourselves to do so- we must look past what we are taught it is only by understanding a different point of view that frees us to discount it to simply dismiss an arguement without thinking about it is ignorance. I cannot claim to be completly openminded I have my doubts about the motives of others as others should doubt my motives.
Can I ask all who read this to reply to this thought: If you were handed undeniable proof that your ideas were totally wrong or completly right would you change how you live your lives?

"If you were handed undeniable proof that your ideas were totally wrong or completly right would you change how you live your lives?"
I like to think so. I don't know if I would, but I like to think I would.

Aenigma, Kant was such a superb philosopher and aesthete (one of my favorites), but I think Socrates had a much better idea. In his "Apology" he states that "For to fear death, my friends, is only to think ourselves wise without really being wise, for it is to think that we know what we don't know." Unless someone follows a particular orthodox, creed, cult, etc., I say Socrates' explanation regarding death is the best way to go. Besides, he was the wisest man in Athens. . .

"Can I ask all who read this to reply to this thought: If you were handed undeniable proof that your ideas were totally wrong or completly right would you change how you live your lives?"

I'm old enough to know that I can't honestly answer that question. But I will say that if I very strongly believed something and was handed proof of otherwise, I would question it to the fullest. Its like this, how do we know we're not a part of someone elses dream?, etc. You could come up with many things to make any proof noll and void if you wanted to.

But - I have changed my beliefs many times in my lifetime. I know I could change my beliefs again, but I can't say for sure.

I don't fear death. I believe in the end we no longer exist. We have either been snuffed out or we have given our selves up to that higher force many of us call God and we make the choice. But the end may take longer than we think.

I could be wrong, but I think all of us from time to time think about why we are here? The heavy questions may not be answered, but in pondering we do learn - it is good for us.

"If you were handed undeniable proof" I have long considered a similar line of thinking. If I could live my life over again seeing how it would be, would I live it differently?
" To answer", is my beliefs based upon what others accept or does my beliefs come from my own being? Having been given the absolute truth, could I understand the truth absolutely? No, I would have to learn (come to understand) the truth, to recognize it's being when I see it. People generally look upon the world as being full of questions that they seek to answer . . . to me the world is full of both the question and the answer, the problem is recognizing which pair go together.

Thanks for your replys- "what if..." I guess I am wondering if people in general are guided in life by the consequences of an afterlife? Also I find it interesting that our lives are often defined by death- but that is undestandable- as without death our lives would have little or no meaning, Time and life become precious comodities. From my stand point if I was right I would not change a whole lot if I were wrong I would definetly change- I don't beleive in heaven or Hell / afterlife school of thought but if I was convinced that was true then I would obviously work to avoid any permanent hell.
It seems everyone here is in the same boat I am That you are to a degree searching for answers and find the search to be stimulating and the thoughts of others to be provocative. We are in the catagory of Philosphies of life- I was hoping you would consider sharing your own philosophies of life- in the braoder sence of who you are how you preceive yourself and the world around you- what is important to you- etc.