Catholics vs Christians - Page 7

Yep that is a new age thing.

If you ever get a chance to go to Rome (I complements of the U.S. Navy), visit the catacombs. There you will learn about a church that existed before the Roman Catholic church. Strangely there is little known about it. True - the history books only go as far back as the Catholic Church, why? There was another church "The Essenes" You won't find them in your history books either, what happened to them? They lived in the promised land before the Roman Catholic Church.

Well, without record my friend, then it could be a strange doctrine selling you theoretical foundations that had no pre-existence, other than by their own acknowledgement.
So, in fact, it is not based on any history, relatively unknown, and suspiciously a false teaching.

Here is proof of Christ's teachings.
He said the gates of hell shall not prevail against it....therefore, He gave the authority over to Peter, who in turn ordained the followers and ordained the next leader as he himself was the VISIBLE head of Christ. IN other words, taking HIS place.

Another factor you should observe is, there is NO accounts...?
That makes me believe this is a new found cult, who is begging to replace Catholicism. For a church to have recognition with Historical background makes it true. Without it, it is horse cuckie. Sorry, but thats the truth.

Another thing you need to look at,.....if it were the first and true church....it would have taught all nations...and it hasnt.

The numbers, in this case...do count.
IF a religion is biblical strong and scripturally sound, it will have all these factors to give for proof.

God does give us knowledge... and facts to back up his faithful.

Concerning these things....
1st Corinthians 2; 11
For what man knoweth the things of a man, save the spirit of man which is in him? even so the things of God knoweth no man, but the Spirit of God.

12 Now we have received, not the spirit of the world, but the spirit which is of God; that we might know the things that are freely given to us of God.
spirit which is of God Romans 8:15

13 Which things also we speak, not in the words which man's wisdom teacheth, but which the Holy Ghost teacheth; comparing spiritual things with spiritual.

14 But the natural man receiveth not the things of the Spirit of God: for they are foolishness unto him: neither can he know them, because they are spiritually discerned.
man Matt 16:23
can he know Romans 8:5, Jude 19

15 But he that is spiritual judgeth all things, yet he himself is judged of no man.



IF I am clumsily explaining...this would be a much BIGGER INSTITUTION than it is...because Jesus wanted all nations to know...and because the Catholic Church was the 1st...it is the biggest based organised religion to date.
IT is received in ALL nations.
And in some, it is the predominant faith....before other christian faiths entered in and gave different teachings.

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Here is proof of Christ's teachings.
He said the gates of hell shall not prevail against it....therefore, He gave the authority over to Peter, who in turn ordained the followers and ordained the next leader as he himself was the VISIBLE head of Christ. IN other words, taking HIS place.

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My answer:

http://www.captaincynic.com/thread.php3/thrdid=15679-u-frmid=17

If you go to the library and look up the essenes, you'll learn all about them. Likewise, if you visit Rome, an historian will take you on tour and tell you all about it. The Roman church has no connection to either the essenes or the church that lived in the catacombs, yet, they existed before the Roman Catholic church. If you believe something is false, that does not make it false. If you believe something is true, that does not make it true. Concerning what most people believe, you can follow the truth or you can follow the crowd, it's up to you.

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IF you know where to look. ......

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As a mattter of fact I just went through a history book for an extract to use in the history thread. It gave a secular account of Christianity which I didn't transcribe but going through what it stated was the dispersion of the church outward to Rome. Peter left the Church of Jerusalem to go to Rome, as the large city had more than one church, he became it's first bishop. Both he & Paul were killed late in the 1st century. Later after the Christian persecution of the late 2nd century, the Roman Catholic Church was founded setting Peter as the 1st Pope.
Speaking to Greek Orthodox, they state that there was division of the church over the Papal issue.
They choose to remain with a central authority of bishops.

As I said, there were many churches, but that Peter remained in Rome, where the Papal is seated.
But, as a Catholic, it has been evidenced, and catalogged with an ancient 'book keeping' the lineage of Popes. And when Christ spoke to Peter, he would be the ROCK in which he would build His church, that is why we have a Pope. The leader of Bishops.
The apostles were all followers of Jesus, and only in respect to whom would be the one to lead, it was Peter.

Well, we know too many indians without a chief makes for chaos.
I do appreciate the history lesson. As I also researched the whole of it many years ago. I was on a mission since I was I have been dragged over the coals for my faith.

According to the several books I read, the Roman Catholic church is the ONLY one who can claim the stature of first church of Jesus.

And Okcity, no clue what you are told, but again, the numbers of followers, and the stuture and credibility would be world reknown.

I mean to say.....that IF in theory the New Age was the first church....they would have as much power sometime as the Catholic church did before the revolt of Protest!

You would have great numbers, you would have the leading edge in how things are equated. The power principle alone is a factor, as well as the numbers.

So, without the rich history, the molding of the entire system of world, and the lineage to the times of Christ, it is a false religion.
Am I being cruel, NO. I am being honest. I am showing you the errors to what they claim.

They need proof.
If you need proof of Catholics, go visit Rome, to the vatican. Where the popes are all buried.

That in itself is good show.

Hmm . . . So who is the authority (head) of your Church?
So I see the Orthodox applying sound doctrinep by leaving Christ as head & the Holy Spirit as guide of your conscious?

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Well, we know too many indians without a chief makes for chaos.

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Yes, Native Americans had chiefs but they were men recognized for their (poweress) abilities. Open council were held in which all participated & agreed upon actions. Even in this the right of desent was recognized, compliance was an individual right.

Christ is the invisible head, Peter was the visible head, and the Holy Spirit does guide.

Popes are in sequence from Peter.

The historian who led the tour claimed that one of the roman ceasors converted to christianity and created the roman catholic church, being its first pope. The roman church however teaches that Peter was the first Pope. Many teachers however do not believe that Peter was ever in Rome. (repeat from other thread).

As I believe that the true church has been taken up. I know you cannot find a true connection between the Essenes and the Catholic church or those in the Catacombs and the Catholic church.

What the church believes today is not even close to what it believed in its incarnation. So how do conclude that I am false? But if you must, fine, your opinion means nothing to me. Your opinion is just one of many. And as you judge me false, so shall you be found false. What you say about others is only the truth about yourself.

I know that I don't know, but am only guessing. You only think you know; and won't you be surprised?

What I do know is, that although many, including Jehovah Witnesses claim to be the first.
I read several books, including the encyclopedia that states over and over the first church was Catholic.
The name Catholic came from the term...UNIVERSAL.

How can I be surprised?

I do know what I studied. I cannot find the New Age anything within ancient texts...nor ancient studies.

Also, if you were to purport this religion as true, then I can only say, that which you probably disapprove of, 'APPARITIONS' of the Mother of God and all the miracles she brings with her, and her Spirit being tested against evil or good, and prooven GOOD....has said....
'The Roman catholic Church has kept the Truth intact.'

She also said, 'The new age religion is false, and do not follow it'.

Therefore, taking the gr8 events surrounding her apparitions, I have to say, besides the Catholic church being 1st, and therefore maintaining the oral teachings.....TRADITION...
it makes sense it would be true and correct that they have maintained the truth.

Besides, if Jesus made His church, He has not changed...He still has great love for His Bride the church.

Can others be saved?

Yes!.....Jesus knows our hearts...and our souls. He judges accordingly...

But if you seek the true church, then study Catholicism.

I also gave the rich histor yof the CC...in another thread...if you have acrobat...or is that called adobe...LOL.

If you read all the passages, you will discover how the churches came about. ...I am not lying, and neither would I make claim to a falsehood, if it were not true.

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read several books, including the encyclopedia that states over and over the first church was Catholic.

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I would take another look at those books. The Roman Catholic Church is not "the first". I've also read a lot of books, I don't remember reading that.

The Roman Catholic Church is the OLDEST, (not the first) organized christian church.

Here is another mystery. I imagine you have seen the symbol of the fish and the bird, these and others like them came from the catacombs. These symbols were found all through the catacombs. Obviously they really meant something to the first church. The true meaning of these symbols, nobody really knows, but everyone is guessing. If the Roman Catholic church was connected to this church that existed in the catacombs, you'd think they'd have a complete understanding of those symbols.

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I do know what I studied. I cannot find the New Age anything within ancient texts...nor ancient studies.

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Why do you keep bringing this up? If it was NEW AGE, why would it be in old text? But you can keep looking if you like.

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She also said, 'The new age religion is false, and do not follow it'.

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So mother marry talks to you?

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But if you seek the true church, then study Catholicism.

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Done that

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Can others be saved? Yes!.....Jesus knows our hearts...and our souls. He judges accordingly...

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For the record my own neice sought advice about joining the Church. I did not advise her to one particular denomination over another, rather I told her what I knew about those she had selected. She chose to become Catholic which was fine by me, I only advised her to 'form intent' of her being an 'impeccable warrior' in her spirit.
PS these terms may be New Age but they are of Ancient origin not written so much of in books.

Essentially, CT, I am the same...I advise the return to church...to God...to Christ.

BUT, with some strange doctrines, their is inheret danger..and now my conscience is cleared...as I gave my warnings.

And accept the conditions of belittlement for it.


Anyway, Okcity....you misquoted what I said....was I not clear?