Questioning God's Existence - Page 4

lastresort, That is exactly what happened. Sure people told me all my life that there was a God but one day I learned it for myself. I met an experience that was basically God saying "Open your eyes I'm right here!"

having had a similar upbringing, i dont feel ive had such an experience. if it is not to personal, could you perhaps describe the experience to us?

It is more personal than I would like to share at this current time, but perhaps later. But even if i told you, you could not accept it because it didnt happen to you.

i have had more than one experience where admitadly, i have said "hello god, hows it goin'?" for a couple minutes, to up to a day. however, after i actually think about the situation that happened i arrive at the same conclusion time and time again.

it all happened threw a series of logical events. Think back to what happened to you... how did it happen... sometimes you have to think back weeks before the actual event, after all, setting a glass one inch in either direction then you did could alter the events of the future dramatically.

My experience involves one of two things. Either an object was physically removed from one location, or I was made unable to see that particular object. And no I was not under the influence of mind altering substances. So if it was not a sign of God then what was it?

inability to see a certain object, is not neccessarily a sign of god. it is perfectly possible to just miss things due to preoccupation with a thought or something else. It may be divine intervention, but from the generality that you've put down, it isnt hugely convincing.
There are little oddities like that that occur, like apparent mind reading. and i dont mean the "proffesional psychics" i mean things like my aunt asking my mum "have you seen my thingy?" my mum replying "its on the whatsit" and my aunt going and getting it. almost no-one would consider divine intervention in that case would they? so whay are certain other circumstances different?

Exactly. There is this large void, and I don't think people appreciate how large, of what we all do not know. And in it the instinct is to fear and from this is conjured up radical waves of imagimation. Things that are now laughed upon in historical texts dating to middle ages as we have discovered what things are. And so it is very conceivable that as science say progresses and the more lucid thinkers grapple the new with rational thought there will be less unkown. It is conceivable it will ultimately be just science that tells us the answers.

But and it is a very BIG but. In almost our entire history this thought process has been almost entirely (and yes there is an almost) down to our 4-dimensional concern of things + some superstring theories that use some imagination to think of others. Now whatever extra is out there which our minds, eyes, ears and all are largely blind to, is something which I cannot say is not God. I could say it clearly is not God but I would be lying. I will say though that to just have a little sense of the ordiley way things seem to happen...events seem to sort themselves out it is almost as if the laws have minds that tell themselves, through silent whispers, how to interact.

I mean I'm not 100% sure that time flows forwards it could be that the past is affected by how we see or how we do things now. This, for example, would totally screw the logical, closed mind up. And that is why education goes further than you think in coditioning you views of things. I am already buggered by talking in English.

Cynic-Al I told you you wouldn't undersatnd because it was not you experience.

i know you did, i was agreeing with you.

as heyjme said, there are a lot of beliefs that science has discredited. for example, the idea that everythingrevolves round the earth, or that the earth is flat. these ideas however, are only based on how things work purely in our own 4 dimensions. my opinion of things is what i think is called "scientific creationism", the belief that science is right about how the universe works, and was created, but that god started it all, and set down the laws of physics to control how it would all work. It is wrong to accept just one idea, and completely disbelieve the other, as there is no proof that either is totally wrong, there may be, and surely are that instances in which both are wrong. but neither are total fallacy

Of course there is some truth in other religions no lie that isn't based on truth can ever exist.

interesting theory. but it is perfectly possible that i could come up with some myth or legend and then with the help of someone with more charisma than me, manage to gain a following. lies do not have to have truth in them, but ill lies are generally more convincing when founded on truth.

Without any truth your myth will fade, there have been countless cults that started and faded because of a lack of truth. To effectively mislead people one must tell them as much truth as possible then add a subtle twist.

true, but if the lie changes subtly over the years to cover its tracks, it could continue for a much longer time. if the change is subtle enough, to provide the hint of answer to any discrepancies then no-one will notice it. there will eventually be significant change, but it will change so slowly, that anyone who could possibly have noticed any large changes would have died before the change is large enough to be noticed.

heyjme, although i do like all the theories about the different demensions, try thinking without realising they exist. forget about 4th demension, 5th and 6th demensions.

but yeah, i think i said what you just said on the first page, as science progresses with knowledge, religion decreases.... and we will never be rid of knowledge because everything goes in a cycle.

roman age: intelligence - dark ages: religion - modern age: intelligence - about 100 years from now: religion.

note how the one religion age was based around pain and suffering.... hmmmm seems like what's starting to happen now... instead of christianity being the main religion it could become muslim.




I believe the jewish belief is as close to natural as it gets, this is because by the time of jesus, people were becomming corrupt. the jewish faith was solely created to bring a group of people together.

heyjme, although i do like all the theories about the different demensions, try thinking without realising they exist. forget about 4th demension, 5th and 6th demensions.

but yeah, i think i said what you just said on the first page, as science progresses with knowledge, religion decreases.... and we will never be rid of knowledge because everything goes in a cycle.

roman age: intelligence - dark ages: religion - modern age: intelligence - about 100 years from now: religion.

note how the one religion age was based around pain and suffering.... hmmmm seems like what's starting to happen now... instead of christianity being the main religion it could become muslim.




I believe the jewish belief is as close to natural as it gets, this is because by the time of jesus, people were becomming corrupt. the jewish faith was solely created to bring a group of people together.
the christian faith is full of lies and deception, which are slowly become uncovered as time progresses.