why do you believe in god? - Page 13

We're not debating on if we need the Quran or not, we're talking about the existence of Allah, and how all these facts in the Quran prove His existence.

Your last sentence "fyi 1400 years ago most people didn't really travel enough to even know of other oceans and seas other than the ones that surrounded their land" just proves my point...How could people who barely traveled at all know that every ocean/river/sea on this planet meeting together don't mix? It's because it was mentioned in the Holy Quran.

i got an extra question for you...Are you an atheist?

no i dont consider myself an atheist, i do see their point though, i also see your point as well, but can you see mine? Like i said earlier your points validate your religion, but Christianity and Judaism can claim the same things, they all have things written in them that make you think twice about what people actually knew back then, whether this information came from god or just a genius human mind i don't know so i wont really stick to just one side of the arguement

Can you show me those "things" that will make me think twice?

i don't need too, you mentioned these "things" already

I have been reading this thread for over two days and perhaps I'm already too late to join in.

In our discussion , we should remember to understand that we do not want to VALIDATE any religion. The question is not about any particular RELIGION. But rather one that should concern all.
Why do YOU believe in God?

When I was very young, I asked my mom, "Why do you believe in God?" She replied with a simple anecdotal 'evidence' and answered, "When you see a building, you know it must have an architect." You can't however base all your beliefs and sum them up with such anecdotes.

In discovering the answer, firstly I must know who I am. What I am? What you think you are? A human being? A father? A player? A survivor? A man? A thinker?

I believe that I am His creation.

The idea of God in my head is that of an inner light. Something that guides me, everytime to find my flash of genius. Knowing that he exists comforts me. An Inspiration, An Icon, A Light. I do not think of God and someone who will punish me when I do something wrong. But rather, someone that guides me to do good deeds.

I don't know why anyone else believes in God. But I do because it makes me happy. Or is it that life, and especially, death are just more comfortable with God instead?

Do you think that the human mind is capable of understanding something like God?.....I think its a little more complicated than that.....I think that quantum physics is starting to point to God. We dont have the first clue....and just because you can't prove something doesnt make it not true. Thats ridiculous. We might not have the capabilities or technology to prove certain things. Now we are finding out things that we never had a clue about. Particles can turn into waves and back into particles, the same particle can exist in two places at the same time, and observing a particle makes the behavior of the particle change. How weird is that? I believe God is Conciousness. Everything you see is God and so are you. I dont think that God is sitting up in the sky outside of us. We are the observer divided out into different points of perspective and because we are observing the world....it exists. Its a paradox. You and I are the same conciousness in different experiences ...we are unending and have been here since the beginning of time. I cant tell you how I know this. I cant prove it but because its not really proveable. I think that we give our scientific experiments a little too much credit. They can prove worldly things but I dont think that a science experiment could prove that we are all the same conciousness. I mean if you think about it...we have different personalities due to the chemistry in our body and our prior experiences in life....these are the things that make us different.....but who the hell are we? we arent our experiences...we arent our chemistry.....so what are we? Who is the thing in my head that is aware of what im thinking? There is a silent observer there.

its you thats sitting there listening, well the you that you haven't met yet

Be aware that whatever is visible came from that which is not. You are humans, you are also great beings. If you want to find the answers to your questions you will find them within yourself and nobody can tell you otherwise. the human experience is unique to the individual.

God to me would be the force of life and all things God that has no beginning, God that transcends this 3D plain of existence therefore transcends the rules and concepts within it. If time began at with the big bang, then time-space began without a cause...cause and effect could not take place without the time required for the cause to take place. OR... the cause came from outside of time or without the need or the concept of time. A realm where time is not / does not exist and is not required. time is a property of this universe. You will not find God within this universe, just as you will not find a meat packing factory inside of a hamburger.

I don't think there is one, at least, not in the standard definition.

There is a big reasson why to think there isnt a god, when u ask ur self. Where did god come from. And thats a question that no one could ever answer but even if god does not exist therea a strong belive that we have got to comw from some where even if it is not god theres gota to be something else that we can call god. Cause nothing is created out of nothin

I believe in God because he is the creator of all. People say that we have to have evidence that he exists, but wouldnt we need accurate evidence to believe that it was a big bang? I believe in God because i grew up that way and have grew to love God with all my heart. He is my God.If you say you have no faith in God, but you have faith in science, you are contradicting yourself. I have my whole heart and faith in him.

I've asked some friends I know and one of them said something to me that I found intresting. He said that if god exists, he may not be a being that supports good or evil, but thinks that god is neutral and could just be a force, not a person. I think we cannot prove it so we can only guess.

Angelfire: "You must find support for you supposition that God is necessary, rather then (as Strongclad pointed out) starting with the assumption (or unargued knowledge) that God must exist. "

I agree with Angelfire to get away from supposing that God is necessary and assuming He must exist so I tend to start from a different place. One that I consider the most factual place I could start, so I invite all fine minds to start with me here...

Fact: Whether one believes in God or not, many people who exist or have existed go/went through life questioning the existence of God and either believe there is one, decide there is not one, or continue to question it.

On science: in academia we speak of two sciences: hard science which involves more measurable, mathematical, provable things that provide quantitative evidence. and "squishy" sciences like social sciences that often have to rely on qualitative evidence. Quantitative evidence is often preferred by researchers, but there are some matters that must employ qualitative measures in order to define measurable terms. Even science sometimes regards subjective information as evidence once they can pinpoint a trend. So here are some questions that arise for me when when pondering the statement of fact I made above. I encourage you to ask yourself these questions and kindly share your answers Obviously God would be a difficult thing to examine quantitatively, but perhaps there are some measurable trends that can be derived from human experience:

Did I wonder about God before someone told me about it?

I don't think so because when I was first told at a young age I recall not believing what I was told and don't recall thinking about it before they brought it up, but I cannot be sure my atheist mother had not already inseminated this opinion. I can say with certainty however that no other person influenced my youthful discovery that I could not fathom "nothing" because of the fact that I existed to think about it. Take away everything in the universe and make it disappear and what do you have? Empty space right? But that is still something. I was a young atheist before this discovery, but became more agnostic after. And here we have another fact to play with...There can never be nothing (we can question this later)

Are there or have there ever been people who have never pondered the existence of God or adopted any stance on the matter what so ever and if so why, and who are they?

Why do so many people ponder the existence of God?

Do any other animals ponder the existence of God in their thoughts, and if not why do humans do it?

Is our intelligence level (our need to explain everything) causing this "God problem" or do we have this need because we were in fact created by a God in his image and likeness as claimed in the Bible?

Fact: There could never be nothing simply because we have existed to think about it.

Is this proof that there must be something?

Is this why people believe in a creator of things?

I think so, therefore I will pose that as another fact for questioning...

Fact: There must be something?

Is this proof that there must be a creator of things?

If things can exist without a creator, why can't there be nothing and why is there anything?

And this brings me back to Angelfire: "You must find support for you supposition that God is necessary, rather then (as Strongclad pointed out) starting with the assumption (or unargued knowledge) that God must exist. "... Well I would say that something is necessary because nothing is impossible since we exist to to think about nothingness. Not assuming that God exists, we know for sure that we do exist. Because nothingness is impossible since we do exist, the question of where everything came from and why, we will always ask... and this is why God, or at least the pondering of His existence is necessary. If this is circular reasoning I contend that there is no way around it because this is the nature of existing as a human being.

As I have gotten older and experienced life I found I needed to believe there was a God. I became a Christian because I yearn for the kind of love the story of Jesus tells. But with atheist roots and an academic mind I am always questioning His existence which is why I ended up here to read other questions and arguments for and against. I hate to think I have been brain washed or have adopted some sort of blind faith out of neediness. But now that I have revisited the nothingness factor I feel better about believing in something because something is always necessary. Whatever I believe in, I will always have to rely on some level of faith that either something came from nothing some how or something always existed some how. "Some how" aka God aka the unanswered / unprovable aspects of existence. For me this means there must be something bigger, possibly a creator, a beginning... you know, that pesky little thing The Bible so ambitiously addresses in the very first line.

Nothing absolutely exists.

Can't you see it, its right there, I'll even show you again.

Nothing. Its a word, it exists. Its a concept, it exits.

But nothing is not allowed to exist... oh? Make sure to read that from multiple perspectives.

Does infinity exist? Oops, obviously, its right there. Well, the concept of infinite everything includes infinite nothing, simultaneously.

This my friend is where you must come to terms with paradox.

You will come to a more comfortable place in your desire for peace through faith when you explore more the definitions and ideas of what this oh so loaded word "god" is.

By generally monotheistic definition, god is all. All something all nothing and all paradox, the holy trinity that is actually a singularity muddled by duality. You have been compromised, divided and conquered, by yourself, for you are god.

Don't look to mans words so much for the answer, just the path. When you stop questioning and simply be still, all is revealed.

You have already asked the questions, now its time to listen for the answers.

My belief in God is a result of several reasons built together over a period of about 60 years.

1. I was brought up in an Evangelical Christian Church so Chrisitianity is part of my heritage.

2. I found, many years ago, that when i doubted the existence of God, God was always the one I talked to about it.

3. God has spoken to me a few times in my life. One time when I was whining about my job, He said to me, "Buck up, Asshole!" And another time when I was not taking enough responsibility as a husband and father He said to me, " You are the Goddamned head of your family". There were a few other instances like this, but you get the picture.

4. I spent some years in my teens and twenties fiercely rejecting the Christianity I was raised in, but one day, out of the blue, I asked my wife if I became a Christian could I still smoke dope? When she said "Yes" I said, "OK, I'm a Christian". And something really happened and changed in my soul. I have believe in God since that day.

5. I have studied about it alot and I believe that there is good historical reason to believe in the resurrection of Christ from the dead. Of course, it cannot be proven, but I am convinced that belief in His resurrection is an acceptable intellectual position. This coupled with the other items above, makes me feel justified in my belief in God. Anyone who is interested in this could start by reading N.T. Wright on the subject.

6. I feel that I know God's presence is with me. Again, can't be proved and I wouldn't try. I could be wrong. But as the years go by this sense of His presence with me has become a constant in my consciousness.

I could be wrong, of course. Agnosticism seems to me to be a very strong intellectual position. I think that Atheism is a reasonable position as well, but it can't be proved any more than my belief in God can be proved. I feel most comfortable with the idea that one can either be an Agnostic who falls on the side of belief or an Agnostic who falls on the side of unbelief.

DBH