Right or wrong.... - Page 5

"I believe things are right in proportion to how much happiness is spread and so are wrong in proportion to how much pain is spread" Sound familiar?

Yes.

And...why do you consider quantity to be more important than quality? why do you think that by 10 people doing 'bad' the 'happiness' that comes from doing 'evil' is more weighty than the 'bad' inflicted upon that one person. In actuality, this methodical thinking itemises individuals. My point is; to see the large picture, one has to understand the concept of value. And the supposed 'happiness' of doing evil is not one that will last eternally; for you, in effect, harm yourself ultimately.

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why do you consider quantity to be more important than quality?

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Proportions, making ten people happy or making one happy, proportionately more is better.

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I believe things are right in proportion to how much happiness is spread

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Notice I said the word 'things' and it being plural and not the word 'individual'. And that I referred afterwards to all life; not just humans.

Are you saying that what the individual does is of no importance?

'If the hand does not move the stick, the stick will not move anything else'. Thomas Aquinas

What the individual does is of precious little significance, but at the same time that changes the character of the form of everything.

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'If the hand does not move the stick, the stick will not move anything else'

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True if one individual does not act then things will not happen. The individual matters more than you care to think

The individual is like a house in a street or neighbourhood. Some houses are bigger, some more grand, some more pretty. But what makes a house homely is the 'people' that occupy the house-even though you may never see this. You can change the housing of the neighbourhood and you may see a change in the 'people' that occupy it; likewise you can change the people that occupy the house and you see a change in the housing. Either way, change it in anyway and you change the 'whole'.

When we go further with understanding, one day we will realise, that it really doesnt matter what the house is made of but that all the unique 'occupiers' are equally valued for they are equal as they are all from the same 'place'.

Who cares about houses? Individuals matter it is not valid to say the whole is more than the sum of its parts because even without a small part the whole would be very different.

Its an analogy.-the 'houses' are our bodies and the 'people' our souls.

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Individuals matter it is not valid to say the whole is more than the sum of its parts because even without a small part the whole would be very different.

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It is not that the whole is more than the sum of its parts but that the whole is different to the sum of its parts. This is what I mean by meaning spreading beyond 1+1=2.

I never said, ever, that individuals dont count. Lol, in actuality thats the problem; individuals count!

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I never said, ever, that individuals dont count.

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"What the individual does is of precious little significance"

Lol...There are 6.4 billion (something like this) 'individuals in the world. I think little can be used. The word that realy counts, truly, is the word precious. I'm sorry if this sounded cynical-its not.

I believe that right and wrong exist to those who believe it exists. I also believe if you have right, wrong must also exist, for every positive has a negative(I think that may have been one of Newtons laws). Hence, right cannot exist alone. The definition of right and wrong changes upon each individual. What I believe to be right, someone else will view it as wrong.

But with no absolute standard we must simply accept all actions.

right and wrong are always going to be subjective. certain things are more likely to be considered right, or wrong by everyone, such as torture and murder being almsot universally considered wrong (though there will be cases in which they may be the right thing to do), and things like charity and politeness being considered right (i cant thin of times where these might be wrong, but there may be examples) but for the majority of times right and wrong are completely subjective.

Right and wrong are absolute values. They can be made to look subjective but they never will be. Just because I think something is right does not make it so. Was Hitler right in his fight to murder all Jews? Subjectively he was, but he was absolutely wrong. Every one who fought against the Nazis was wrong subjectively but absolutely right.