What is religion? - Page 3

Zato....would you please define God, as asking this question or trying to answer it connotates that you know what God is.

Simple answer to the rock question: God can create a very large rock. The second He creates it He hasn't tried to lift it so He "can't" lift it. As soon as He tries to lift it, lo and behold, He can lft it. Thus, God can create can create a rock He can't lift, but He can then lift it.

Ask a stupid question, get a stupid answer.

When I refer to "God" I am usually referring to the Christrian God or ones like him.

When Newton first devised his laws of motion in his principles paper, he was keen to not that these laws referred to the physical state of the universe. He noted that these related to bodies having mass, and thus related to the obdervable and quanifiable properties around us. Einstein was keen to show these laws didn't apply at speeds approaching the speed of light and proposed some new ones. Quantum physics then showed us some remarkable things.

Whilst things can be observed and predicted at similar spatial references, it seems they apply to fairly rigid laws of behaviour. However, when one thing is viewed from a quite different spatial frame of reference, the observable behaviour becomes less predictable and seemingly the laws that apply at one scale do not necessarily apply at the other. I.e. the tiniest may folllow a law when viewed from the reference of another 'tiniest' observer, but when viewed from macroscopic thinking modes, they appear to behave erratically, or to be precise, with non-conformity.

What this means is that science does not have laws insofar that they do not work everywhere all the time, so they are not really laws. This is pretty much where we are now. Some scientists believe that there may be a full equation to describe the behaviour of the universe. However, even this would not explain why.

It has been all too common in science for one to claim the answer only to find it disproved. For example, Freud may have been able to explain and predict human behaviour, but of course once he did this, we can use this knoeledge to change our behaviour, thus proving his theories are just that.

What science does is scratch away slowly at the surface of things. It may know the mind of God but does it know the heart of God?

For example I heard it claimed the best chat-up line scientifcially speaking is somehing like 'in a years time, lets have fun together'. This refers to security and fun. But said wrongly, it would mean nothing. The descriptor of life is never as pure as the feeling one gets from it.

And thats what science is a descriptor. Now to my point, religion is exactly the same. It tries to explain spirituality using descriptors of association to educate. They are both DESCRIBING reality but in different ways and for different goalposts but with the ultimate aim of finding truth.

I know of it, but dont want to discuss, the complications in religion and politics; we find this everywhere...its up to your intuition.

And thats the point for me. Spirituality is a pure feeling, a oneness, kind of like in the physical world when you are extremely fit.

As to what God is; maybe he is an equation. But the equation would only make sense at his level. In any case, logic is a good tool, but you can confuse logic by having the wrong start point and the wrong end. Thus, there is far more to life than boring logic or any other tool for that matter. The highest of forms is a pure senstation that allows access to a large source of potential. All the greatest people who have lived have been close to this source.

I have been debating in my life over the past few months or so on whether to give up logic in trying to understand life. Even with logic, I think that anything still could be wrong or right or anything. Not really sure how to describe what Im saying. Maybe i'll rewrite this later.

see zato, if your refferring literally to religious Gods which everyone has pre concieved notions of, then you are right in whatever you are saying. That God can't to anything, because nothing like that exists, the concept of a Christian or Muslim or Hindu God only exists in our minds. But don't let that close your mind to the possibility of something greater.

There is one way all religions can claim to be true... that being that God told them all different stories... although it is still possible to form a religion without involving oneself with such a God...
An omnipotent God, with freewill about all, perhaps not... perhaps ruled by Godly-nature and logic... a giant rock can be transformed to be liftable where it was not before, but there would be consequences... an unliftable rock perhaps could just involve so much destruction that it would be morally impossible for a God to do such...
Then again, what of the idea of many Gods who have various natures and moral responsibility... and what if they take turns being the God in charge of speaking Truth to the world and require a different name and have a different feel... Giving rise to different religions all speaking with 'God'...
Even without a God, could we ever live in a world of something so heavy it could not be lifted... what if God already carries the whole Universe already and as nothing would exist outside the Universe then no such rock could be created...
It would meet the matter of definition, of what existence is...
Omnipotence needs to be best described as all that is possible, not just what you might imagine possible... it depends on what the definitions are for 'existence', 'universe', 'God', 'possibility', and 'nature of the Universe'...
Back to the topic of what religion is... a 'group' (the people), the 'word of God, Guru or Guide' (the truth of what the Universe is), a 'plan for action' (the moral possibility for action and consequence), the 'literature' (where it is all recorded)... all are important...
The religion usually aims at excellence, highlighting the acts of 'God, and/or Guru, and/or Guide' and also the people of whom it shall have relevance... it aims at describing what the world is and what to do while we are here...
Luckily religions often agree about many topics such that they've been allowed into Science, Law, Politics and some Freedom of Speech...
It is believed by many (or at least I assume) that either the world will be made to realise the exact truth of the matter of religion, and God. This will happen either by the 'Grand Gesture' of the 'One (or Ones) Above' , or by the excellence in the field of science and other forms of logic...
My best bet, is to ask the 'Experienced'... the old, the wise, the powerful, the geniuses... their best words for the world... or just to try and read from their works and those of the past...
Others may have the confidence enough to tell you which ones, which books, which religion, which God(s)...
Note that a large portion the world is led by a couple of handfuls of books, easy enough to read in a lifetime if not a few years... at least then you may know what the others are lead by...

heyjme... the laws do take place at the speed of light because speed depends on your refrence... plus, you can travel at the speed of light therefore the laws must apply... furthermore einstein was a fucking idiot.

Strong opinions lastresort; your going tocause some controversy at some point....lol. I think the ideas I was presenting apply to our laws in relation to scales...space and time; e.g. did relativity and quantumn mechanics exist in the early stages of the big bang, if you believe in the big bang? Why can't relativity and quantum mechanics be meshed-are there different laws for the tiniest of particles compared to macroscale ones? Science may answer these. Still, will it ever say why it is the way it is, or just describe what it is?

I don't know why there have to be divsions in the understanding of life. Life is not only quantum mehanics and relativity, not all about cause and effect. But science stops at how, it doesn't go into the why's, leaving that to religion and spirituality.
You can have all the intellectual knowledge you want, you can discuss the relativity of time, the uncertainty principle of quantum mechanics, the string thoery- but if you limit your knowledge to pure logical analyisis, then you probably won't really unearth the mysteries of life. God is in everything, you just have to look, have to learn to feel withought intellectual knowledge sometimes. There should be a balance, you shouldn't forget what the feeling of life is, and you shouldn't become incapable of logical discussions.
If you know how to love life, that is all that is required- no God, no purpose of life, love alone is enough.